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Ninja 1000 (1000 SX) Off Road

5K views 36 replies 10 participants last post by  anurag1212 
#1 ·
Arthury, this is for you. CAN-do. With street tires no less.



 
#3 ·
ha ha .. thanks, @OCL. Just happen to see your post.

I think I'm not going to shake loose all the parts in my Ninja with this kind of roads. There's no need for this. For them (in India), I believe some of their roads are unpaved in many villages, away from big cities.

I have been constructing a short list of bikes for Backcountry Discovery Routes (BDR). So far, nothing stands out because it's a struggle to balance among these 3 requirements:
  1. weight of motorcycle (lower better for off-road)
  2. comfort on long distance asphalt (to get to the BDR roads): bigger engine (less vibrations) - conflicts with [1].
  3. seat height : higher is better for off-road but my inseam is only 30" --- vertically challenged!
The closest compromise is a 2022 Honda CB500X (released in Europe) but we'll see when they come to the US. Have to mod it with Rally Raid and add a few protection accessories from SW-Motech for BDR, though. No sure, if I will enjoy the vibrations at 65 MPH. Heck, I may end up with an Africa Twin (low seat option), although the Versys650 and Vstrom650 may be viable as well. The gadgetry of the BMW R1250GSA is eye-popping but the Sterling Noren incident with the shaft breakage is scary. Just thinking out loud ...
 
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#4 ·
Arthury, I'm about the same size as you.

Weight: Yes lower is better off road. But also the height of where that weight is located matters A LOT. You can have the same weight bikes, but if one has a lower center of gravity, that bike will feel lighter AND will be easier to pick up from a drop.

Comfort: For long trips on asphalt, two words: wind protection and a comfy seat. You can have a slow-*** bike, but when you have the former two, you will be just fine. Engine vibes are not an issue with any modern motorcycle. The new KLR for example, appears to have minimized vibrations from its big thumper (You Tube ride reviews of the 2022 model).

Seat Height: See weight above. A bike with a high center of gravity will feel "taller". I was able to put one foot down on my 35" seat height DR650 because it had a narrow seat and low weight. Off road, it was actually easier to put both feet down because the ground was softer and the bike's tires sat lower into the soft ground. Sounds counter intuitive but that's how it worked out for me. However, when I loaded the bike's rear seat (bags filled with stuff and extra fuel), my DR650 felt top heavy.

I honestly think the KLR650 the right bike for all the above. The new one has a lower seat height and a lower center of gravity compared to the old bike. It has over 250 miles of range (excellent for BDR work). It has excellent wind management. It's smooth for a big thumper. The price new, tops out at $8k MSRP. I'm seriously considering this bike myself. I have a VStrom 650 XT and I also love this bike. I don't know if I want to take it on a BDR route with a lot of off road though. It does well on Forest Service roads rated "Easy". It starts to struggle at "Moderate" rated trails. Or maybe it's me who starts to struggle...LOL! Regardless. The KLR will eat up Moderate trails that my VStrom would find challenging due to suspension limitations.
 
#5 ·
Arthury, I'm about the same size as you.

Weight: Yes lower is better off road. But also the height of where that weight is located matters A LOT. You can have the same weight bikes, but if one has a lower center of gravity, that bike will feel lighter AND will be easier to pick up from a drop.

Comfort: For long trips on asphalt, two words: wind protection and a comfy seat. You can have a slow-*** bike, but when you have the former two, you will be just fine. Engine vibes are not an issue with any modern motorcycle. The new KLR for example, appears to have minimized vibrations from its big thumper (You Tube ride reviews of the 2022 model).

Seat Height: See weight above. A bike with a high center of gravity will feel "taller". I was able to put one foot down on my 35" seat height DR650 because it had a narrow seat and low weight. Off road, it was actually easier to put both feet down because the ground was softer and the bike's tires sat lower into the soft ground. Sounds counter intuitive but that's how it worked out for me. However, when I loaded the bike's rear seat (bags filled with stuff and extra fuel), my DR650 felt top heavy.

I honestly think the KLR650 the right bike for all the above. The new one has a lower seat height and a lower center of gravity compared to the old bike. It has over 250 miles of range (excellent for BDR work). It has excellent wind management. It's smooth for a big thumper. The price new, tops out at $8k MSRP. I'm seriously considering this bike myself. I have a VStrom 650 XT and I also love this bike. I don't know if I want to take it on a BDR route with a lot of off road though. It does well on Forest Service roads rated "Easy". It starts to struggle at "Moderate" rated trails. Or maybe it's me who starts to struggle...LOL! Regardless. The KLR will eat up Moderate trails that my VStrom would find challenging due to suspension limitations.
Ideally, for an asphalt/off-road (60/40) application, I think these 2 bikes are probably the best:

I'll have to sit on them to try them out at the dealers to have a good feel for the ergonomics.
 
#7 ·
Big Rock Moto does really good, honest reviews, even though the host does get a bit whiny and can talk endlessly sometimes. LOL! He generally does like the KLR after his initial test ride. And this guy has an AT, a GS1250, etc., and is an expert off road rider. He also did a pretty honest review of the 2018 VStrom 650 XT. I watched this video too and he was hauling *** off road on the VStrom and he kept bottoming out the suspension! It wasn't until he slowed down and things calmed down, which was when he admitted this is the way the VStrom needs to be ridden off road. He didn't have any such qualms with the 2022 KLR650. He was cruising at a good clip off road on it.

Tenere 700 is like a merging of the KLR and the VStrom, which means it rocks off road! On road, the VStrom has the edge as it's optimized for on-road handling. It's also lower to the ground, which makes it easier to handle at slower speeds, and you can ride it like a sportbike at higher speeds. The VStrom 650 also has a higher top end power at a higher RPM, which means you can wind out the motor and be more fun that way. I like that about my VStrom.

If I can only have one bike, I think I'd get the Tenere 700. But if I already had a Ninja 1000, I would gravitate towards the KLR650. What pushed me towards the VStrom 650 versus the Tenere 700 is the presence of tubeless spoked wheels on the VStrom. Tenere has tubed tires. And the fact that the KLR wasn't out yet when I bought my VStrom.
 
#10 ·
That is something you will see a lot of debate from adventure riders and dirt bike riders.
In the past, bikes with spoked wheels essentially had to run tubes, because the rim wasn't sealed (every spoke went through a hole in the rim). Now we've got tubeless spoked rims, but there are bikes that come with traditional style spoked wheels that still need to run a tube, and this complicates the discussion, because it on some cases the choice isn't just about a tube vs tubeless tire, but about spoked vs cast aluminum wheels (with a potential big difference there in how durable a rim is).
With a tubeless tire, you can generally use a simple plug kit to make a temporary roadside repair to a puncture. With a tube tire, you would need to remove the wheel from the bike so that you can remove the tube and either patch it or replace it.
 
#9 ·
You can repair most tubeless flats using conventional methods FROM THE OUTSIDE, while the tire is mounted on the rim and on the bike.

You cannot repair tubed tire flats from the outside. You MUST remove the whole wheel off the bike, remove the tire off the wheel, replace the tube, re-install...in the field. Suffice it to say, this solutions sucks donkey balls! It's hard enough to do that at home, imagine doing that in the middle of nowhere, with rocks and dirt all around you and it's 85 degrees F outside. It can be done but it's a royal Pain in the A$$! This means if you have tubed tires, you must always carry the tools to remove wheel and break the tire bead, and lift the bead off the wheel.

This is exactly why I went with the VStrom 650.

Take a quick look at the KTM 390 ADventure. Direct competitor to the Honda CB500x, but better off road and already off road ready from the showroom. The 390 ADV comes with tubeless tires and costs less than the Honda, but faster than the Honda!
 
#11 ·
[...]
Take a quick look at the KTM 390 ADventure. Direct competitor to the Honda CB500x, but better off road and already off road ready from the showroom. The 390 ADV comes with tubeless tires and costs less than the Honda, but faster than the Honda!
The KTM 390 is a European bike and it is also made in China. ;)
 
#13 ·
The KTM 390 Adventure was made in India in 2020, but I believe they are now made in the the Philippines beginning 2021. The Honda CBR500x and KLR650 are both made in Thailand. A number of Triumphs are also made in Thailand. Some BMW's are made in China.

VStroms and Tenere's still made in Japan. Their pricing are still able to support building them there. Someday it may not.
 
#15 ·
The KTM 390 Adventure was made in India in 2020, but I believe they are now made in the the Philippines beginning 2021. The Honda CBR500x and KLR650 are both made in Thailand. A number of Triumphs are also made in Thailand. Some BMW's are made in China.

VStroms and Tenere's still made in Japan. Their pricing are still able to support building them there. Someday it may not.
Thanks for the correction and no offense to European bike fans. BMW, KTM, Aprilia, etc have exciting products.
And, I have owned brand new BMW M3's before and still own a M235xi. It's just that their parts are significantly more expensive.
 
#29 ·
This guy really understands what "Adventure" stands for. He nailed it. At least that's how I view it and that's how I ride. Although he makes it look super easy when he's hopping around those rocks! I go much slower on rocks like that. Thanks for posting!
 
#23 ·
While in the mountains recently after a flood, I had to take a gravel road with a medium sized washout. It was a ***** to keep it upright. Love the Michelin Road 5 tires, but they might as well have been bald! And stopping on tiptoes, me on the Ninja offroad is a bad combo!!!
 
#24 ·
LOL, the forum software doesn't like female dogs!

from the video, "just drop a gear and disappear!" (y)
 
#26 · (Edited)
Looks like DCT will help when you're faced with hairy situations during off-roading.
 
#27 ·
Wow, that article takes me back to the laundry list of things that used to cause me problems riding in the dirt. That was on a <300# 2 stroke dirt bike. I can't even imagine tackling some of the stuff they did on a 500+ pound bike. Nowadays I break too easy and heal too slowly to have a go at that stuff again...🤕
 
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#30 ·
I sold my DR650 (and miss it when I go off road). I wanted something more "KLR-like" with more power and better pavement handling. But I still want to be able to explore forest roads and desert trails (all in the Easy category of course).
So I took advantage of the fantastic used bike values available and sold my DR650 before I put too many miles on it (32k miles when I delivered her).

Said my goodbyes to her....:cry:
Untitled by rogue_biker, on Flickr

Got this in her place....more comfortable and much, much faster. Can still off road (albeit at a much slower pace).
Untitled by rogue_biker, on Flickr
 
#33 · (Edited)
No Arthury, it won't surprise me at all. You've been hit by the bug. Mine hit back in 2017 and haven't looked back since. I hardly ride with my sport bike friends any longer. Every weekend for me lately is exploring some dirt road I saw on Google Earth.

For someone like myself who's been riding street for far too long, there really isn't anything new to experience. Within a 300 mile radius of my home, I've ridden almost every interesting road. It's time for a change of pace, scenery, and attitude. I don't like crowds anyway, and I don't much like going to a faraway destination only to encounter a bunch of tourists doing the same thing that I am. ;) I much prefer to get away from just about everyone. The Adventure style bikes gives me that ability.

If you end up with an AT, I will wager your Ninja will not be ridden at all (assuming you're not trading her in). Good luck and ride safe.
 
#34 · (Edited)
[...]
If you end up with an AT, I will wager your Ninja will not be ridden at all (assuming you're not trading her in). Good luck and ride safe.
I'll probably trade in my CBR1000RR SP. What's the use of keeping a speed-devil when I cannot legally speed on the street and I do not go to the tracks. I'm using less than half of what it can do... sigh. Just 2 days ago, I rode on the CBR1000RR and have forgotten how my legs are folded backwards so high up, I felt like I was in a prone position on the bike ... definitely not for me at this age ... and I ain't no Jalapeño Salsee (ooops, I meant Valentino Rossi). Those who want to be and do it on the street, usually get their license revoked or get maimed or killed.

I'm keeping the Ninja because it is comfortable and I can still go on longer trips.
 
#35 ·
Arthury, I think you and I are exactly on the same wavelength.

The Ninja is plenty comfortable for me as well. Even with its slightly forward riding position and the slightly high foot pegs, I still find it comfortable for all day rides. Having said that, the ADV riding position is the most comfortable for me.

I like the AT as well. I didn't get that bike because I knew for a fact that if I did get that bike, there would absolutely be no reason for me to have a Ninja 1000. Because the AT does 95% of what the Ninja does, which includes very long tours. Weighs about the same as well. I'm not quite ready to be Ninja-less. Perhaps I'm there and I just don't want to admit it.

Knowing what I know now and my current viewpoint, the ideal combination would be a big, liter class ADV bike that satisfies all my cravings including power. Plus a lighter Off-road centric ADV bike like a KLR650 or even a KTM 390 Adventure. If I didn't have a wife filled with common sense and one who needs an explanation for everything, I'd probably be doing this now. :LOL:

I could foresee that conversation: OCL, why do you need two ADV bikes? Because one is for going really fast and the other is for off road. OCL, but both go off road. Doh.......leave me alone.....:rolleyes::LOL:
 
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